Just say NO

General Discussions: ASK John: Just say NO

By Dana on Wednesday, December 12, 2007 - 08:48 am: Edit Post


I love this site and part of making this site great is that you don't have to look through Pop-up AD's on every page. So I ask, is the site so busy that the costs have went up that much? If Pasty is charging you more maybe it is time to move to a lower cost hosting company.

I hope you understand were I am coming from. I mean, from your writings and posts I don't think you are doing this for the money, so what can be done to not have to look through these Ad's by Google.

Again thanks for the great site, but please No Google AD's


By John Dee on Wednesday, December 12, 2007 - 09:30 am: Edit Post


First I need to say I have to be careful about how I talk about Adsense as Google does have some rules.

Secondly, I will say that the Adsense Program is something that may or may not continue on this board. It is something that was reccommended to me as a potential revenue source so I am giving it a try.

Third, there are costs in maintaining a site as active as this and those costs will only be increasing in the future. I spend anywhere from 5-7 hours a day working on things related to the site. While I do not have the site purely for the money, I think it is a fair thing to say I am not spending 5-7 hours a day working on it for my health. I am not retired. I am 41 years old and have a family to support. Thus I do need to have the site generate money for my time, or will have to look for other sources of income, which would mean shutting down the site to remove the financial burdens as well as free up my time to make money in other ways.

I have never directly asked for money from any of the visitors to the site (even in posting classified ads on the board) and all features have always been free. I want to keep it that way, but the only way to do that is through advertising. There have been donations made to me for the upkeep of the site, but they have declined steadily and substantially in the past several years.

I use google's G-Mail and they run the same exact ad script in thier e mail service (exact same look and word matching feature). When I first switched to the G-Mail, I was not that thrilled with those ads, but then in the course of just a few days they actually started to grow on me and I now find myself using them from time to time. Since I get an e mail message from every post on this board, I was able to see how the ads would match up with the posts on the board and in most cases the ads were right along with the content of the post and of the site. Sure there will be ads that do not relate directly to the sites theme- especially on posts in the Off Topic Ramblings, but I have been closely watching the contents of the ads with the posts on the board sent to me via e mail and for the most part, they match very well- Especially in the Classifieds, Area Conditions and Info and most of the posts in the Miscellaneous topics, which are the three most popular on the board.

I realize there are folks that just do not like change or do not like advertising, but a website of this magnitude does not come free, both in the cost of my money and my time and the amount of revenue it generates needs to be increased, or I will no longer be able to keep it going.


By Eric Koehler on Wednesday, December 12, 2007 - 10:37 am: Edit Post


What about setting up some sort of meter to show us how much is needed in donations to keep the site free of ads?

Then, people could relate to what is required and would have a goal to meet.....

just an idea.

By John Dee on Wednesday, December 12, 2007 - 11:00 am: Edit Post

It's a neat idea Eric, but it is not simply an issue of how much the site costs to run on a day to day basis, but how much of my time I put into it.

I do not think there is a person out there that when asked to put 5-7 MORE hours a day into their work day would not want to be compensated for that. Me being self employed am responsible for finding ways to make more money. I cannot ask for a raise or work overtime. I need to create new revenue streams.

The site does make money for me, but not nearly the amount that I could bring in if I did other things with my time and talents. So it is costing me money in lost revenue, not pure expendatures. It would be very hard to quantify that other than to say my time is worth X amount of dollars and I put Y amount of time into the site and should thus be compensated Z dollars, which is X * Y.

Like I say, things will likely be adjusted so that the ads are on topic as much as possible. Up to this point in the history of the site, I have tried my best to keep any ads that appear on the site on topic. Even going as far as to turn down friends that wanted to advertise, but had businesses that did not match up with the theme of the site. This adsense is all new to me and as I learn more about it will customize it to fit as best as it can and in a manner that it is useful and not a distraction- just like the other ads on this site.


By dat600 on Wednesday, December 12, 2007 - 11:42 am: Edit Post

come on people give John a break here,
these ads are no big deal,
if you think about it Snow Central brings
us constant info/weather and entertainment
it's a whole lot better than CBS News,
and probably a whole lot more of us 'watch'
John than those who watch Corric,
and she makes millions a year.....

I think you all get my point,
love the ads John,
love the site,
thanks for all you do,
and have a Very Merry Christmas
and a Prosperous New Year

By FRNash/PHX, AZ on Wednesday, December 12, 2007 - 12:21 pm: Edit Post

Please see the other thread on this same topic:
Click ® General Discussions: Miscellaneous : What is this add stuff over here>

By Average Joe on Wednesday, December 12, 2007 - 12:41 pm: Edit Post

Ditto that dat600!

By Jim Pasquesi on Wednesday, December 12, 2007 - 12:46 pm: Edit Post

I simply cannot believe anyone would object to ANYTHING on a completely free web site like this! So what if there are Google ads? Nobody is forcing you to come to this free site. John should be able to make as much money as he wants, and deserves, from all the thousands of hours of hard work he has devoted to this site. I still can't believe that John hasn't started charging membership fees, like the boating forums I belong to. Anyone can view those sites, in a limited way, but to really post and get pictures, you need to pay. What makes this site any different? IT'S FREE, that's what's different! John, thank you for all that you do and have done to provide such a wonderful imformative site!

By Carole on Wednesday, December 12, 2007 - 12:55 pm: Edit Post

Ads or no ads, I will be here. This is the first site I go to in to morning and the last at night (and during the day at work).

Thank You John for all that you do and provide to the public at your expense.

By brian schlagel on Wednesday, December 12, 2007 - 12:59 pm: Edit Post

Ditto Carole's thoughts.

By FRNash/PHX, AZ on Wednesday, December 12, 2007 - 01:23 pm: Edit Post

If you're so pleased with this site, then please just put your money where your mouth is, and support John's work directly: Click ® Help Support John Dee.com

No extraneous ads, no third parties, just your $ in direct support of the site!

John has always been rather "low profile" in soliciting donations to support this site, and in fact, I believe it was my suggestion very early on that got him into the use of PayPal for that exact purpose!

Just do it!

By REVman on Wednesday, December 12, 2007 - 01:49 pm: Edit Post

I didn't like the adds right away either, but I would NEVER have the nerve to tell John that. Not on a free site! It's just something to get used to...and now that I've been on for awhile, I don't even notice them.

I think we need to think a little before we type! This isn't our site. It still belongs to John. If this is something he feels is necessary, then it must be. He hasn't led us astray yet!


By Scott Bojan on Wednesday, December 12, 2007 - 02:28 pm: Edit Post


I respect and understand your need to generate revenue through this site, I actually wondered how you kept it going with the minimal amount of ad space you had on the front page.

In the search for increased revenue I might suggest you look at the Totallyamaha web site. They offer VIP memberships for $25 a year. The actual benefits the member gets from this are in my opinion minimal, non VIP's can still view and post messages but I buy the membership each year to support the site. I know it may require going to a new board which I could imagine would be a PIA but perhaps worth it for the revenue it could generate. Maybe you could do something creative like letting people who are VIP members read your journal for a few days before it becomes available to the general members, hold the forecasts for a few hours for non VIP's or even just block the ads for members.

I have come to think of the type of site you operate(specific to 1 sport or area and that share a significant amount of information)to be like a magazine subscription that I get to read every day. That is well worth a few bucks a month. That said in all the years I have been coming to your site I had never noticed there was a request for donations on your forecast page until I started looking at it on my BlackBerry recently and had to scroll through all of the top text.

Thanks for everything you do to keep this site informative, fun and educational. May you, Nora and Burt have a very Merry Christmas.

By Matt Balitewicz on Wednesday, December 12, 2007 - 03:07 pm: Edit Post

This is a great site, and I'm surprised it has remained free. Kudos to John Dee and anyone else involved in maintaining this site.

By Scott Davis on Wednesday, December 12, 2007 - 04:06 pm: Edit Post


The term you are looking for to describe your time and talents may be Opportunity Costs


By Slednek on Wednesday, December 12, 2007 - 04:38 pm: Edit Post

I say you do whatever you need to do to keep things rolling on this great site and putting food on the table and in front of Burt.

There is no other site like this one worth visiting with as much of useful information as this one. Looking at a few ads is the least we as free-loaders can do to keep the site going.

Great work John!!

By olsmann on Wednesday, December 12, 2007 - 05:30 pm: Edit Post

I say make as much money as you possibily can, John ! Snowmobiles are not cheap, 4 wheelers are not cheap, new homes are not cheap, wives are not cheap, life is not cheap and time is money. I agree, every second you spend on this site is a second you could be doin somthing else to generate income or better yet its a second you could be spending with your wife and/or family. Life is to short, I dont think there is a person on this site that would work 5-7 hours for free everyday. I click on the as much as I can.

By John Dee on Wednesday, December 12, 2007 - 07:40 pm: Edit Post

Thanks everyone. I knew setting this up would cause some folks to sour a bit, but I also know that in time they will get over it or in a very few cases stop visiting.

I have thought about other ways to generate revenue such as a membership fee for specific things, but that just creates a whole new set of things to deal with and take up my time.

Believe me, my free time is all spoken for! I do get out to play (just came back from a nice ride), so I am not complaining at all about my work load with this site and the other daily tasks, just stating the fact that I needed to find a way to increase revenue without increasing work load and this was a perfect fit for that.

I am greatful for all the feedback (positive and negative).

Thanks, heading off to sleep!


By Dana on Wednesday, December 12, 2007 - 08:51 pm: Edit Post


Thanks for responding to my question. I was thinking that was going to be your answer, but I figured I would ask anyway. If I didn't someone else would have.

I understand and can feel your reservations about adding AD's to your website. I was just hoping there was a better way then with Google Ad's

Thanks again,


By Polarisrider on Wednesday, December 12, 2007 - 10:22 pm: Edit Post

I found that you just need to make the window smaller from the right side sliding it to the left and you can cover up these ads. left click and grab right side of window drag to the left presto!

By mark hastings on Wednesday, December 12, 2007 - 11:25 pm: Edit Post

So just out of curosity, do you get money for just having them their to view, or do you get money from people clicking on an add? Because I can do a hole lot of clicking if it makes you more money?


P.S. I think it is a great idea, I don't mind adds, but hate membership fees.

By John Dee on Thursday, December 13, 2007 - 04:35 am: Edit Post


One of the things I am not allowed to do is discuss how the ads produce revenue for me. Actually Google does not even share their formula. I can see how much money the ads have generated and can say the ads produced revenue in the past 24 hours and I was pleased with the results.


By fusionfool on Thursday, December 13, 2007 - 06:06 am: Edit Post

I support any way to make this site keep going. I did not even notice the adds untill people started chatting about them. We are so used to the addes every where it is like the bill boards going down the hiway. I personaly will now keep clicking on the adds now just to see if this will help bring in more $ for your site. If this works it is a very simple way that I can donate. Who knows I might even find somthing I am interested in.
Again Thank you for your time and efforts with this site, and keeping us all posted on the thing we all love. SNOW:-)

By REVman on Thursday, December 13, 2007 - 12:15 pm: Edit Post

I have an idea...Mods...delete these threads as soon as they pop up on here. John has spoken...adds stay...end of the story.


By dat600 on Thursday, December 13, 2007 - 05:05 pm: Edit Post

'these ads are no big deal'

I take back what I said before,
these ads are a big deal,
they are a blast,
they actually update to the thread,
with all kinds of deals and ideas,
this is like a Christmas present to a surfer,
I've already discovered several sites
I never knew existed,

Thanks again John
Merry Christmas

By Brian on Friday, December 14, 2007 - 07:51 am: Edit Post

I dont like the adds but if it helps pay for the high cost of fuel for you to go out and ride and bring back some good pictures go for it!
I like checking out the pictures of the winter snow you take from the ares that are less traveled.

By Brian on Tuesday, December 18, 2007 - 06:29 pm: Edit Post

It's called earning a living, we all do it in some form or another.

John has always conducted business on this site in a very respectable manner. That's why this site is so popular. From what I see the ads do not distract from the function or content of the site.

By thinkinsno on Sunday, December 23, 2007 - 11:03 am: Edit Post

I must be missing something here. When the ads first appeared I simply smiled. In my "humble" opinion, anyone who would complain about anything on this site needs to find another site that he/she can openly make suggestions to the owner of that site. I believe that most of us have never looked for anything wrong, but simply appreciate our priviledge of spending our time enjoying and learning from John Dee and others who post useful information on a wide variety of subjects!

I'd venture to say that nobody here could or would come up with the money to pay for this priviledge.

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