2 Stroke oils

[srt20]

There is a thread on HCS in the Polaris IQ forum about 2-stroke oils. A retired chemist from an oil company is testing 2 stroke oils on his own. The guy seems to be legit, he isnt partial to any brand so far.

After some of the threads the last couple years about certain oils, this thread is a nice change of pace about ACTUAL testing.

Im not trying to start any bashing, just letting people know about this thread. I will be changing my oil brand after reading his tests.

[whitedust]

Just found a case of 4 gallons of Blue Marble in the garage if anybody wants to buy it. $100 for the case. If it sells great as will take me forever to use up in chain saw,weedwacker,packback blower & outboard.:)

[snowfish]

Wow! Quite a read, but appears to have some real answers. Thanks for the heads up.

Just in case y'all need a quick link.

http://www.hardcoresledder.com/forums/298-iq-chassis/547495-oil-i-know-i-know-23.html

Nice to see how civilized everything is.

[samc]

Lengthy thread, very interesting............

[ezra]

looks like interceptor failed and sea and sno failed but the Mystic Jt4 passed so looks like if buying oil at fleet farm time to move up 1 shelf and spend the $25 on the JT4.

[snowbuff]

Wow! Interesting thread, thanks for posting it. I know what I'll be running after reading that. Looks like Indy is right after all!!!

Thanks again.

[fusion]

Wow - now THAT is a good thread, and good information. Amazing the guy would have time to do all that work. He must have loved his profession to do all that analysis. If I ever go back to 2-strokes, it will be completely different oil than what I've used in the past. No more interceptor.

[xcsp]

If you like that thread on HCS, you may also like this one regarding fuels & additives:

http://www.hardcoresledder.com/forums/432-rush-switchback-pro-ride-chassis/531672-gasoline-tips-your-rush.html

[russholio]

Interesting, but.....bottom line is, how many folks truly have oil-related failures? Not counting running the machine out of oil, that is. Most engine guys will tell you that there are very, very few. Over the years in various machines (including a PWC) I've run Doo mineral, Doo semi-syn, Doo full-syn, Klotz, Spectro, Legend, Amsoil, and Sea and Snow (sorry, Indy and PR1). Not one oil-related failure in tens of thousands of miles -- in fact, only one failure at all and that was because a grenaded belt trashed my outer PTO seal, and at that time I was unaware such a thing could happen and didn't know enough to check it).

Call me picky, but personally I'm a bit skeptical of a guy who calls himself The Chemist (implying that he has a background in chemical engineering) yet can't use proper spelling, grammar, or punctuation.

If you use an oil that meets the specs called for by the OEM, then oil is oil. Nope, I'm not switching.

[tyeeman]

I tend to agree with russholio. I mildly challenged him on a couple things and it seems like he got a little stressed at me. I also asked him to post his test info, even PM me if he didn't want the world to know and he wouldn't do it.
I what is the test method? Is he doing bonifide ASTM tests or is he doing the one armed bandit test you see the Schaefer oil guy doing? He says he does a 4-ball wear test, ok, at what time, what pressure, what temperature. It is a legitemate industry wide test. DATA DOES NOT LIE.
Heck coud tell every body that I tested extra virgin olive oil and it beats the pants of Polaris VES Gold, and it keeps my exhaust valves clean. SHOW ME THE DATA!!!

Oh well, I'm new to HCS and didn't want to pi$$ everybody off. Didn't think it would go very far considering the oil I am interested in, and will keep using, , , , well lets just say the cards were stacked against me.

[Hoosier]

Maybe this is a dumb question, but why can't someone do a test like this and legitimately publish the results outside of a web forum? I assume the reason is that it would cost quite a bit of $ to do the tests in a way that can be peer-reviewed and not result in getting sued. Plus there probably isn't much upside to doing so. I'm also assuming the magazines can't commission the tests as they need to be cognizant of advertising revenue.

That HCS thread was interesting to read, and I am glad it was referenced here, but how can you trust the results of someone just because he calls himself the Chemist? I use Interceptor, and I have no real basis to do so other than what I read from the internet and in magazines and what I hear from other people I ride with who I trust and are more knowledgeable than I am. Plus you can normally find it at gas stops if needed. I've never heard of anyone actually having an oil-related break-down, but on the other hand most winters I ride between 1000 and 2000 miles and it doesn't seem to make a whole lot of sense to try to save a couple dollars by buying cheap oil unless I know for sure it is good.

Not trying to start a pissing contest (again), just rambling really.

[xcr440]

Not to mention, 99.99% of riders will never stress test an oil to it limits in a sled.

[mjkaliszak]

Like russholio said : hard to prove any oil failure in my camp. I will say that the thread was lenghty and was surprised at how good POO VES gold did. I stopped using it years ago because I could not see the color when mixed w/gas. I burned down a wacker due to my stupidity. The $40 a gal hurts too... one year we went thru 22 gallons. Good to see i CAN MIX THE SEA & SNOW WITH REDLINE or Legend.... I bet the Legend is flying off the shelves at the snowmobile guy's store. Those were some severe specifications " The Chemist " was using. I too did find it odd that the grammar & punctuation was not 100%. I hope for everyones sake that he is legit... what a honorable thing to do. I must say I hope he is....
Hats off to the Chemist !

[mjkaliszak]

[QUOTE=srt20;241753]There is a thread on HCS in the Polaris IQ forum about 2-stroke oils. A retired chemist from an oil company is testing 2 stroke oils on his own. The guy seems to be legit, he isnt partial to any brand so far.

After some of the threads the last couple years about certain oils, this thread is a nice change of pace about ACTUAL testing.

Im not trying to start any bashing, just letting people know about this thread. I will be changing my oil brand after reading his tests.[/QUOTE


Thanks for the "heads up " !

[russholio]

Not to mention, 99.99% of riders will never stress test an oil to it limits in a sled.


Those were some severe specifications " The Chemist " was using.

Seemed to me as well....but not being a scientist, I don't really know what's a fair test and what isn't. Nonetheless, I hope for the sake of his readers, at least, those that are putting stock in his work, that he's legit.

[srt20]

Well if nobody has ever had a oil related failure I guess its no big deal that anybody switches brands of oil then....

I was using Poo blue just because I was sick of paying $35 a gallon for Gold. Now I will use Mystik JT-4 for 21.99 a gallon. And since nobody has ever blown up using sea and snow( which is a oil that failed his test), I should really be ok with this oil since it did pass the test.

Save $$$ and according to him, get a better, full synthetic oil.

[mjkaliszak]

I burned down my xrs end of last year, w/S&S... I don't know what caused this but will be tearing into it shortly. I leaned it to BRP spec the 16.5mm. My budd had it set outrageously... Like 2.5 qts per 100 miles. Maybe 3 qts. It was crazy but now it's down. Most of the time my calamities are my fault or lack no prudence on my part. After a few catastrophies I shut down , pull belt and drag them back to base camp.

[xcsp]

As some have mentioned, engine failures may not be oil-related, or could they be if the oil doesn't "cling" to the metal surfaces within the engine if it sets for some time between use and not fogged?

Could be more engine failures due to improper off-season storage practices or fuel-related issues?

In regards to oil quality, how good of an oil is needed in a 2-stroke engine as it is injected, mixed with fuel and burned/consumed? It isn't like a 4-stroke where the same oil is recirculated over and over for X amount of miles or hours.

Any thoughts on the above paragraph?

[polarisrider1]

New Poo gets VES Gold Plus until 3 plus gallons are gone, then Amsoil Inteceptor. Dealer said they will back if issues with motor arises. Just got an order for 17 gallons of Interceptor. Must be crap. Lol. Love the smell. Run Amsoil In everything I own with a motor, but the dodge may not be worthy.

[Skylar]

New Poo gets VES Gold Plus until 3 plusguys gallons areea gone, then Amsoil Inteceptor. Dealer said they will back if issues with motor arrises. Just got an order for 17 gallons of Interceptor. Must be crap. Lol. Love the smell. Run Amsoil In everything I own with a motor, but the dodge may not be worthy.

Of course it is crap, The Chemist said so, sorta. LOL.

[whitedust]

When my doo 800 froze the crank & torn down every part was coated with Blue Marble so was NOT an oil related failure & I was infact very impressed with Blue Marble Oil. The doo factory sealed bearing failed & rings were flaking all bad engine tech from doo nothing to do with oil type.

[groomerdriver]

If "insert words here" was posted by anybody in the internet, it must be true. S&S in the 2strokes I own and never a problem.

[indy_500]

:D

[90s]

I used Legend in my 2010 Rush 4000 miles, last season in my 2011 Rush 3,000 miles. Previous to this I was using/tried major brand(s). I noticed less smell and the valves stayed cleaner longer with the Legend oil. Legend will be going in my 2012 Adventure after break-in. The only problem is finding it locally. I loaded up on the oil at the Milw sno show. It would be nice if an unbiased/independant lab would conduct industry standard tests on two stroke oils that we use.

[ezra]

that is why they 'doo'have to have a short block program and why it is so popular

[snoluver1]

I used Legend in my 2010 Rush 4000 miles, last season in my 2011 Rush 3,000 miles. Previous to this I was using/tried major brand(s). I noticed less smell and the valves stayed cleaner longer with the Legend oil. Legend will be going in my 2012 Adventure after break-in. The only problem is finding it locally. I loaded up on the oil at the Milw sno show. It would be nice if an unbiased/independant lab would conduct industry standard tests on two stroke oils that we use.


Why "after break in". Better to break in on non synthetic anyway. Might as well use the legend from day one. Suck the synthetic coolaid out before you even pull the rope!

[whitedust]

that is why they 'doo'have to have a short block program and why it is so popular

Yep pretty much screwed without that program. Costly too but what can you do? I was back on snow in 7 days with new engine & very pissed & married to that sled longer than I liked. Eventually bought Yam 4s & never going back to any 2s engine.

[ezra]

it is not the 2 but the doo many 2s run over 10k with no issues and but then the chasi is close to shot.

[motor_slut]

Interesting, but.....bottom line is, how many folks truly have oil-related failures? Not counting running the machine out of oil, that is. Most engine guys will tell you that there are very, very few. Over the years in various machines (including a PWC) I've run Doo mineral, Doo semi-syn, Doo full-syn, Klotz, Spectro, Legend, Amsoil, and Sea and Snow (sorry, Indy and PR1). Not one oil-related failure in tens of thousands of miles -- in fact, only one failure at all and that was because a grenaded belt trashed my outer PTO seal, and at that time I was unaware such a thing could happen and didn't know enough to check it).

Call me picky, but personally I'm a bit skeptical of a guy who calls himself The Chemist (implying that he has a background in chemical engineering) yet can't use proper spelling, grammar, or punctuation.

If you use an oil that meets the specs called for by the OEM, then oil is oil. Nope, I'm not switching.

Are you really that ignorant? The best scientists are the worst spellers and writers. That is why they are scientists. I wouldn't, and don't, trust writers who write about things in perfect grammar just because they are writers. There are so many bloggers, writers, and journalists who feed us garbage in perfect english and too many people take it as being truth because it is so well written. I have seen about a hundred or so oil failures in my life as a mechanic. There are good and bad oils and many people religiously use bad oil.

[russholio]

You're entitled to your opinion. I'm sticking with mine. I still feel that somebody who was allegedly educated as a professional ought to be able to communicate like one. If people take something as truth because it is well-written, well, I don't know what to say. Maybe they should have done more research into the issue. But the writer did his/her job in presenting the information in a professional manner.

And please, when you attack this, I would appreciate you omitting the name-calling. Thanks.

[ezra]

so when they hall you in the emergency room with a massive head trauma be sure to ask your surgeon for a writing sample.
scientists/doctors/and me are notoriously bad spellers and lazy punctuates jokes have been made about doctors for yrs.
most laboratory scientists have recherche assistants to do all the tedious work like writing the findings writing the papers etc.real ez to blow off proper punctuation after you graduate.
and after 40yrs of having a assistant's doing your dirty work forget about it.

[polarisrider1]

so when they hall you in the emergency room with a massive head trauma be sure to ask your surgeon for a writing sample.
scientists/doctors/and me are notoriously bad spellers and lazy punctuates jokes have been made about doctors for yrs.
most laboratory scientists have recherche assistants to do all the tedious work like writing the findings writing the papers etc.real ez to blow off proper punctuation after you graduate.
and after 40yrs of having a assistant's doing your dirty work forget about it.Well thar esplanes me pore penminship and spellin. it muzt bee ta hot chix int da offis whooz typs four me.

[ezra]

that's what I got minus the hot part

[Hoosier]

How much would a reputable, independent test cost? We could put together a fund here on Johndee.com and get it done. Then there could be no more 2 stroke oil threads going forward.

[indy_500]

How much would a reputable, independent test cost? We could put together a fund here on Johndee.com and get it done. Then there could be no more 2 stroke oil threads going forward.
Sea and snow is junk. Klotz is good. Testing accomplished.

[russholio]

Sea and snow is junk. Klotz is good. Testing accomplished.

This "test" is about as good as the testing allegedly performed by "The Chemist".

I don't believe you, Indy, because your spelling, grammar, and punctuation are spot-on (well, except for not capitalizing the "S" in "Snow" -- but I'll overlook that as a simple typo). :)

[Hoosier]

Sea and snow is junk. Klotz is good. Testing accomplished.

Well done.

[thebreeze]

Hey indy, why klotz?

[polarisrider1]

that's what I got minus the hot part Well, she was when I hired her 31 years ago. To prevent damage to my head and shoulders I must continue to believe that.

[polarisrider1]

Sea and snow is junk. Klotz is good. Testing accomplished. Indy we already know the S&S part. I thought you was an Amsoil man?? I switched to Polaris VES Gold Plus this year. (got 3 1/2gallons for $40). Fireside sale, should hold me for part of the winter. Did you get a deal on Klotz?

[motor_slut]

I call it how I see it. And how I see it is you are a very uneducated man. So your opinion has no clout on the subject matter. That is just my opinion.

[russholio]

And how I see it is you are a very uneducated man. That is just my opinion.

Again, you are entitled to your opinion -- as wrong as it may be, which in this case is 100%. So sorry to be the bearer of that bad news to you.

[russholio]

interesting, but.....bottom line is how many folks truely have oil related failures? not counting runing the machine out of oil that is. Most engine guys will tell you that there are very, very few over the years in various machines (including a PWC) i've run doo mineral, doo semi syn, doo full syn, klotz, spectro, legend, amsoil, and sea and snow (sorry, Indy and PR1). Not one oil related failure in tens of thousands of miles in fact, only one failure at all and that was because a grenaded belt trashed my outer PTO seal, And at that time I was unaware such a thing could happen and didn't know enough to check it.

call me pickey, but personaly I'm a bit skeptical of a guy who calls himself The Chemist implying that he has a background in chemical engineering yet can't use proper spelling, gramar, or punctuation.

if you use an oil that meets the specs called for by the OEM then oil is oil. nope i'm not switching.

There, I've edited my original post to more closely resemble the elementary school level of writing exhibited by "The Chemist". Is it now more believable?

[indy_500]

Hey indy, why klotz?


Indy we already know the S&S part. I thought you was an Amsoil man?? I switched to Polaris VES Gold Plus this year. (got 3 1/2gallons for $40). Fireside sale, should hold me for part of the winter. Did you get a deal on Klotz?

Take some sheet metal and stand it up. Put a few drops of oil of any brand on the sheet metal and see how long it stays on there. Amsoil & Poo VES GOLD is gone quick. Klotz probably sticks for the longest of any synthetic snowmobile 2-cycle oil. Synthetic Blends and Mineral oils stay on the longest, why? Simple, they're thicker. Does that mean they are better? Yes and no. They have their plusses and minuses, one being they cling to metal, keeping your bottom end lubricated as long as possible. But, they dirty up exhaust valves, and don't flow as well in cold weather. Might I add, have you ever smelled Klotz? :)

I may be forgetting something... Oh yeah, 800 miles after switching from arctic blue to citgo sea and snow, my pto crank bearing was shot, tore the pto crank seal to shreds. Was it oil related? Who knows, all I can say is I'm never putting that stuff in my sleds again.

I paid $35 a gallon btw. Have a half gallon of poo ves gold to run out that came with my 500. Started my sleds the other day. 700 ran like a raped ape on the stand with the new clutching. Don't know if I will ever want to get rid of that beast.

[xcsp]

Indy_500, why did you switch from Arctic Blue to S&S ?

Here's "the chemist's" latest:

TESTED: Legend ZX-2SR: First off under the microscope this oil is not a synthetic oil, but an ultra pure highly refined mineral oil, the molecules are very small, the pour point was -54f. R.P.M. before brake down of the oil viscosity and film strength is unknown. My test unit only goes to 16,000 R.P.M. and the oil never broke down. This oil is going to be my new oil in my new rush switchback 800, and yes i checked the oil three times in my machines this oil is the best i have tested.

[Hoosier]

.

[Firecatguy]

Take some sheet metal and stand it up. Put a few drops of oil of any brand on the sheet metal and see how long it stays on there. Amsoil & Poo VES GOLD is gone quick. Klotz probably sticks for the longest of any synthetic snowmobile 2-cycle oil. Synthetic Blends and Mineral oils stay on the longest, why? Simple, they're thicker. Does that mean they are better? Yes and no. They have their plusses and minuses, one being they cling to metal, keeping your bottom end lubricated as long as possible. But, they dirty up exhaust valves, and don't flow as well in cold weather. Might I add, have you ever smelled Klotz? :)

I may be forgetting something... Oh yeah, 800 miles after switching from arctic blue to citgo sea and snow, my pto crank bearing was shot, tore the pto crank seal to shreds. Was it oil related? Who knows, all I can say is I'm never putting that stuff in my sleds again.

I paid $35 a gallon btw. Have a half gallon of poo ves gold to run out that came with my 500. Started my sleds the other day. 700 ran like a raped ape on the stand with the new clutching. Don't know if I will ever want to get rid of that beast.

I run SS in my sled and cleaned the valves yesterday....have no plan of switching after seeing how clean they burned.....bummer so many have to take this so personally around here

[ezra]

I have also been running S&S for many yrs with no issues. I deff do not ride like a grandma plan on sticking with it.I own nothing that that runs at 16000 rpm so I think I am ok.and power valves are always clean no scraping no sticky gummy goo just clean

[polarisrider1]

Wow !!!! we made to the same place as all the past oil posts end up. no where.

[700classic]

Wow !!!! we made to the same place as all the past oil posts end up. no where.Simply amazing isn't it!!

[xyooper]

I like bread!

[Hoosier]

Wow !!!! we made to the same place as all the past oil posts end up. no where.

The chemist could have told you that was going to happen!

[1renagade]

So is it only the Doo's that fail?

[ezra]

I like bread!
me to Guitar man is my fave they did http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CpOjQvADLG4

[ezra]

so pr1 that is a place the oil thread has never gone before and prob never again lol

[ezra]

there is a place the oil thread has never gone PR1.Black gold Texas Tea oil that is.
and yes 1gade it is the doo's fault for using a sealed bearing in a crank case

[thebreeze]

But really, what is the best oil?

[salmonbum]

I have bee running sea ands snow for quite some time now in my Xp and Rev and the rave valves look the way I want them to.

I just have a hard time listening to some kids advise on how his 10 yr old sled failed on it right after an oil switch. I would bet a hamburger that oil had nothing to do with it. But that's enough evidence to call it junk? I have been huffing 2 stroke smoke twice as long has he's been on this planet, so I think I will trust myself.

[indy_500]

You get what you pay for. Go support Hugo Chavez...

[xcsp]

If you pay more for the oil, it HAS to be better? Right?

[polarisrider1]

If you pay more for the oil, it HAS to be better? Right?Right. shop walmart and by china made products too. Never come crying to me that your job has been eliminated. Buy American (U.S.) as american as you can get. Getting sick of all the pee pants whiners driving Jap cars wondering where the jobs have all gone. support your Neighbor buy Amsoil, Mobile 1, Chevrolet, Polaris, Sea Ray, John Deere, Catapiller, Carharts, Ariens, Hudsonville Ice cream, whatever we make here. I don't really care but stop bitching and support your Country. I give a rats *** about the perceived "deal "on S&S oil. Is it a deal if it did not come from a U.S. refinery that provides U.S. jobs. p.s. my power valves are spotless too. It is the same tight as**s that will not support the local Snowmobile clubs and expect Motel room rates to be dirt cheap and not tip at the bars to the north and truck in their Walmart groceries instead of buying from the Mom and Pops in the North woods and help their fellow American. Truck in their Sam's club Citgo gas and wonder what happened to the gas station by their cabin, They stand in the northwoods gas stations and say out loud, "Gee, I am not paying X amount for sled oil" dispite the fact you forgot yours at home. Oh by the way anti up tight wads trail permit is $45 this year. I will rat you out ASAP if it is not stuck on your sled. (not picking out xcsp just attached to his response.) You know who you are.

[ezra]

don't want Hugo to get your money better stop buying gas now and start walking to school

[Firecatguy]

poo oil and cat oil mixed in same building here in Mn http://www.lubetech.com/contact/

Harley oil is Mobil oil....you guys understand that they pour a drum oil in same pipe line and take a drum out at the refinery so oil is oil its additives!!!you think giving cat 48a gal is ok? I do not......highway robbery I buy my oil at fleet farm which was a Brained Mn start up company family owned.......oil is oil...who drills it???you know who the big 4......and controlled by opec......

[polarisrider1]

poo oil and cat oil mixed in same building here in Mn http://www.lubetech.com/contact/

Harley oil is Mobil oil....you guys understand that they pour a drum oil in same pipe line and take a drum out at the refinery so oil is oil its additives!!!you think giving cat 48a gal is ok? I do not......highway robbery I buy my oil at fleet farm which was a Brained Mn start up company family owned.......oil is oil...who drills it???you know who the big 4......and controlled by opec...... Okay (by the way Hi Pat) who the heck makes the bottles? Come on who makes the bottles! lol sorry trying not to laugh! That darn Harley oil anyways. lol

[Firecatguy]

hehehe plastic is plastic...hahhaha

[indy_500]

I buy my oil at fleet farm which was a Brained Mn start up company family owned.....
And me works for them. Lots-O-China made products I put out on the shelves. Even found a ceramic heater that said "made in chian" so bad they can't even spell their own country!

Arctic Blue is also made at lubetech...

[Firecatguy]

And me works for them. Lots-O-China made products I put out on the shelves. Even found a ceramic heater that said "made in chian" so bad they can't even spell their own country!

Arctic Blue is also made at lubetech...

um so i have it right you choose oil for "where its made" well then you better come to the kitty side as Poo is a Mexican company that was started by a mn family......just sayin.....

also they are not "made' at lube tec they are "mixed" at lube tec oil come in bulk to them......so its the additives....

[ezra]

and on a side note if Mr hope and change would pull his head out .
the Canadian pipe line could start being built this yr employ thousands and thousands of workers and reduce our dependence on non north american oil buy1/2 in less than 10 yrs.
his bigest priority is jobs is it not? yeah right.

[ezra]

not defending citgo but just saying they have 3 refinerys #1 Lemont IL #2 Lake charls LA #3 Corpus christy TX

[Firecatguy]

Chinese own the one by my house....Ashland oil,supermoms etc.....belive its called something else now so they can split supermoms off from ashland and sell their donuts at Holiday gas now.......

[700classic]

Mmmmmmmmmmmmmmmm donuts!!!!!!!!

[samc]

Now I'm hungry for a donut........ LOL

[polarisrider1]

Chinese own the one by my house....Ashland oil,supermoms etc.....belive its called something else now so they can split supermoms off from ashland and sell their donuts at Holiday gas now.......

I suspect the Chinese own the bank that owns my house. They will take over our Country without firing a single shot. We ship ocean liners of cash to them and they ship us trinkets back. They still have the green long after the trinkets get sent to the landfill. Since we are a throw away society we just order replacements from them and the cycle continues.

[thebreeze]

Oil, The Chinese, Hugo Chavez, donuts, bread, Citgo, Canada pipeline, Obama, etc. Who knew talking oil brands leads to such worldly discussions? lol

[indy_500]

um so i have it right you choose oil for "where its made" well then you better come to the kitty side as Poo is a Mexican company that was started by a mn family......just sayin.....

also they are not "made' at lube tec they are "mixed" at lube tec oil come in bulk to them......so its the additives....
Osceola plant was reopened No sled stuff is made in Mexico, only rzr parts

[polarisrider1]

Oil, The Chinese, Hugo Chavez, donuts, bread, Citgo, Canada pipeline, Obama, etc. Who knew talking oil brands leads to such worldly discussions? lol Actually it is Hugo Chavez that causes all the discountent, the rest is a diversionary. This topic will never be resolved. Oil and gas brands vary by region also. tough to find S&S in my area. Amsoil is sold all over in my neck of the woods. I prefer Shell V Power in my sled and motorcycle, truck gets BP, car gets Speedway or Admiral. All the oils work, all the oils have careracteristics that influence your purchase, some oils are better at certain things. So we all want something from our oil that is different from each other such as price, availabilty, Synthetic or not, who makes it, VES cleaning abilty, how well it sticks to a pc. of sheet metal????, smell is a big one, and on and on. We will never answer this one and all agree.

[russholio]

Actually it is Hugo Chavez that causes all the discountent, the rest is a diversionary. This topic will never be resolved. Oil and gas brands vary by region also. tough to find S&S in my area. Amsoil is sold all over in my neck of the woods. I prefer Shell V Power in my sled and motorcycle, truck gets BP, car gets Speedway or Admiral. All the oils work, all the oils have careracteristics that influence your purchase, some oils are better at certain things. So we all want something from our oil that is different from each other such as price, availabilty, Synthetic or not, who makes it, VES cleaning abilty, how well it sticks to a pc. of sheet metal????, smell is a big one, and on and on. We will never answer this one and all agree.

So basically, we either line Hugo's pockets or we line the pockets of somebody in the Middle East similar to the late Saddam or the late Moammar, who would like nothing more than to see the U.S. wiped off the face of the planet. Nice options, eh?

Nonetheless, PR1's post is probably the best answer I've seen yet to the age-old question about oil.

[polarisrider1]

So basically, we either line Hugo's pockets or we line the pockets of somebody in the Middle East similar to the late Saddam or the late Moammar, who would like nothing more than to see the U.S. wiped off the face of the planet. Nice options, eh?

Nonetheless, PR1's post is probably the best answer I've seen yet to the age-old question about oil. Thank you. Sad to say, but we are prisioners to oil, no matter what brand it is. Even you 4 strokers need oil.

[maddogg]

I use S&S because Skylar does.

[russholio]

Thank you. Sad to say, but we are prisioners to oil, no matter what brand it is. Even you 4 strokers need oil.

And we all need gasoline for our sleds, too -- but that's another thread. :rolleyes:

Yep, it's just a question of which despot/tyrant/dictator/creep gets our money.

[ezra]

it could be Canada and USA gets to keep the money if we stopped acting like children as far as our natural resources were concerned.we have more than enough oil in our own yard if we were allowed to go out and get it.are we real about energy independence and jobs or just lip service

[Skylar]

I use S&S because Skylar does.

LOL, thanks, I think.

[thebreeze]

Well I decided to test some oil on my own tonight.

Test procedure:
4' x 8' piece of ply wood.

1 ounce of each oil was placed at the top of the ply wood that was tilted agains the garage wall. The oild that were tested were as followed:
Mystic
Klotz
Legend SR

I rate them as the following:
#1 Mystic. It was clearly the thickest and most purple. Everyone knows purple oil is the best oil, and thickness is key. It finished last in the race across the plywood. That means it protects the crank well.
#2 Legend SR. It smells the best. Smell is everything when it comes two stroke oil. It traveled to the bottom of the board the fastest. Fast oil is good oil.
#3 Klotz. It absorbed into the wood the best. It must be enviornmentally friendly. Envoirnmentaly friendly is always a good option.

[Hoosier]

Well I decided to test some oil on my own tonight.

Test procedure:
4' x 8' piece of ply wood.

1 ounce of each oil was placed at the top of the ply wood that was tilted agains the garage wall. The oild that were tested were as followed:
Mystic
Klotz
Legend SR

I rate them as the following:
#1 Mystic. It was clearly the thickest and most purple. Everyone knows purple oil is the best oil, and thickness is key. It finished last in the race across the plywood. That means it protects the crank well.
#2 Legend SR. It smells the best. Smell is everything when it comes two stroke oil. It traveled to the bottom of the board the fastest. Fast oil is good oil.
#3 Klotz. It absorbed into the wood the best. It must be enviornmentally friendly. Envoirnmentaly friendly is always a good option.

And here I thought indy was the chemist for this site with his revolutionary sheet metal test. But this plywood test is even better. Next thing you have to do is put the oil in a little plastic gear hand-crank display like they do at the auto parts store that shows you how well the oil sticks to the plastic gears.

[russholio]

Well I decided to test some oil on my own tonight.

Test procedure:
4' x 8' piece of ply wood.

1 ounce of each oil was placed at the top of the ply wood that was tilted agains the garage wall. The oild that were tested were as followed:
Mystic
Klotz
Legend SR

I rate them as the following:
#1 Mystic. It was clearly the thickest and most purple. Everyone knows purple oil is the best oil, and thickness is key. It finished last in the race across the plywood. That means it protects the crank well.
#2 Legend SR. It smells the best. Smell is everything when it comes two stroke oil. It traveled to the bottom of the board the fastest. Fast oil is good oil.
#3 Klotz. It absorbed into the wood the best. It must be enviornmentally friendly. Envoirnmentaly friendly is always a good option.

It's a good thing you started testing, because The Chemist says he's no longer going to. Somebody asked him for photos of his equipment, ASTM references, calibration standards, procedures and reference standards for repeatability, and the where his lab is located. Somebody else asked him if he works for Legend. So now his feelings are hurt by all the "negativity and hate" on HCS and he is no longer going to test.

I want to believe your test, Breeze, but I'm not sure I can because you write too well!:D

[russholio]

it could be Canada and USA gets to keep the money if we stopped acting like children as far as our natural resources were concerned.we have more than enough oil in our own yard if we were allowed to go out and get it.are we real about energy independence and jobs or just lip service

Oh, we're real about it -- as long as it's not in MY back yard. :rolleyes:

[Team Elkhorn]

I rate them as the following:
#1 Mystic. It was clearly the thickest and most purple. Everyone knows purple oil is the best oil, and thickness is key. It finished last in the race across the plywood. That means it protects the crank well.
#2 Legend SR. It smells the best. Smell is everything when it comes two stroke oil. It traveled to the bottom of the board the fastest. Fast oil is good oil.
#3 Klotz. It absorbed into the wood the best. It must be enviornmentally friendly. Envoirnmentaly friendly is always a good option.

Ive said it before, Ill say it again. I only use Purple PowerLube because its the best. Breeze's test proves it.
It soaks though the old style cardboard containers, so it absorbs well. (Environmentally friendly).
Also when it soaks through, it leaks out and runs out all over the place quickly. (Fast = Good).
Sometimes, I cant get it to come out of the container without a fight, so it sticks to stuff well. (Sticky is also good).
And most important, its purple. (And it stinks good).:)
The only down side is they haven't made it in 40 years and its hard to find.26038
:(

[700classic]

Oh, we're real about it -- as long as it's not in MY back yard. :rolleyes:No need to worry, I don't think Hazel Park is a hotbed for Oil exploration!:)

[thebreeze]

I read that whole thread over on HCS, and my first inclination was that the "The Chemist" was Mark from Legend.

[russholio]

No need to worry, I don't think Hazel Park is a hotbed for Oil exploration!:)

Hey, you never know what's down there.....the city was built on a dump or a swamp or some other piece of less-than-desirable land. But in saying "MY" I should have said "OUR", since this seems to be the prevailing attitude of our society.

[alwaysright]

[QUOTE=Firecatguy;243243]you better come to the kitty side as Poo is a Mexican company that was started by a mn family......just sayin.....
QUOTE]

How is poo a mexican co? Please state references...

That's like saying Cat is a Jap co. Get a clue man.

Funny to me that in sleds, technology and every other aspect of life everyone wants progression but when economics progress, everyone is up in arms. Workers need to progress as global economy does or they will all be left behind. Sorry it's not 1952 anymore.

[polarisrider1]

Rumour has it that Mystic and S&S are the same thing from Citgo. Am I out of the loop on this one???

[xcsp]

Rumour has it that Mystic and S&S are the same thing from Citgo. Am I out of the loop on this one???

You're back in the loop! Tell us you weren't on that other site reading the "oil thread" LOL

Yes, it is true:

https://www.citgo.com/Products/MSDS/MystikLubricantsMSDS.jsp